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On Thursday afternoon, Vince McMahon appeared on the Pat McAfee Show. Here is a summary of the appearance.
They shake hands after Pat introduces Vince.
Pat says he cannot believe that Vince is here. Vince tells Pat to call him “Vince” and Pat says he wants to show him respect. Vince says that he knows that Pat says a lot of things about him.
Pat mentions that they have talked behind the scenes. Pat says it is an honor for Vince to be in studio for the interview.
Pat says that everyone knows Vince’s name. Pat mentions Wrestlemania and calls it the global standard for live events. Pat asks Vince if he knew he was going to be doing something like this as a kid.
Vince says he did not believe it. He does not think that way. He does not believe in ceilings or milestones or pats on the back. He believes in doing things.
Pat asks about the WWE Network and how people questioned it and how everyone is doing subscription services now.
Vince says everything they do is calculated and you need to have smart people around you. Vince says he had a great deal given to him by Comcast. The lawyers tried to tie your hands on creativity and who owns you. It was about creative control and being in control of your destiny.
Pat says he respects Vince and mentions how he owns his show.
Pat says that he does not think anyone could do what Vince did.
Pat asks if Vince has heard people say that wrestling has gotten better due to him.
Vince says he does not try to listen to that. He says the pats on the back screw with your mind. If you listen to the positives, you have to listen to the negatives. If you deal with the negatives, you have to deal twice with the negatives. Members of the media will say what they will say and you cannot change things. If people think you are an a**hole, you can’t change the way people thinks about you. Vince says he is a good guy and he loves his family. He jokes that Pat is an a**hole. It is hard to change the public’s perception of him. Vince says he cares about how people feel about him as it relates to the business.
Pat asks when did Vince stop caring about what people say about him. Vince says when you first start out and give everything you’ve got and people call you something you are not, it bothers you at first and you try to correct it. Then you spend too much time trying to correct your image. You can’t care about what the media or people who don’t understand you say.
Pat brings up the evolution of wrestling and what Vince has done to make a regional product into something global.
Pat asks why Vince does not like the word ‘wrestling’. Vince says he wanted to separate them from everything else. Vince mentions how his father branded it World Wide Wrestling Federation and how it separated him from everyone else. At the time when he bought his father’s business, his father did not know what he would do. You have to separate yourself and brand yourself.
Vince mentions they used to be the WWF and Pat mentions how the panda got them. Vince says it was a no win situation because he was sued in England so he decided to change it. Vince says he didn’t even know about the World Wildlife Fund at the time. Vince says it was easy to change it. It took 30 minutes to ‘Get the F Out’.
Pat asks Vince about how many ideas he has had to create over the years and there have been some brilliant moments. He asks if he has always been creative. Vince says it is a team and he has great executives. Creatively, he listens to someone else. You cannot learn when you are talking. Vince says he can read if Pat is listening to his s***.
Pat talks about how people tell people going into the Hall of Fame, he does not want people to mention him.
Vince says that he will be the man to induct the Undertaker into the Hall of Fame.
Pat asks why is Vince doing it. Vince says he loves the guy. They have known each other for a long time. When you live on the road, you have to have a family on the road and people you can count on and rely on. You need people who are trustworthy and Undertaker is that type of guy. Vince says he can talk about the character, but he will be inducting the person. He says he cares about Undertaker and is close to him.
Pat brings up how it would have been massive if Undertaker left WWE, but he stayed and was loyal.
Pat asks if the War with Turner changed him
Pat mentions AEW and their purchase of Ring of Honor and what does competition mean to him. Vince says he is one of the few people in the world who enjoys competition. Vince says he loves confrontation. It puts him on his toes. Vince says he learned as a kid, he made it through the beating so what can you do to him. He relishes the competition.
Vince says him and Undertaker never had a conversation about him going to WCW.
Pat asks if the mental toughness separates him from everyone else. Vince says he is wired differently than everyone else. Vince says it is who you are and you know what your strengths and weaknesses are.
Pat asks if Vince had dreams about being incredibly wealthy. Vince says he wanted to be everything he could be. Vince mentions growing up in an 8 foot wide trailer without running water. He says you want to be successful and reach beyond where you are. Vince says he doesn’t know how much money he has and Pat says we know how much he has.
Vince says there was a period of time after Wrestlemania IV or V when he thought was somebody and had an ego, but that lasted 6 months. You put your pants on the same way. Vince says he was doing what he wanted. Vince says it is amazing that he is around after what he lived through.
Pat mentions drinking in the past and asks what Vince has done.
Vince says this is not work and he loves what he is doing.
Pat says that people think that Vince has no heart when he makes his decisions, whether it is to release someone, push someone, or keep someone and whether one type of decision is more difficult. Vince says he is always concerned about what is best for the audience. Sometimes there is dead weight and there is someone waiting to do something. He mentions how Hogan came back. He might have felt that he was never going to use someone again, but if it is good for business, you do it.
Pat mentions the decision to bring people back and if it is a personal or a business mindset. Vince says it is not personal, it is business. Taking the company made him run the business better. He was making decisions with his heart instead of his head when it was a private business. Now you have to deal with stockholders and you owe it to the business. This way he can make better business decisions.
Sometimes when people are not given the opportunity or it doesn’t work when they are given the chance, you aren’t the one who is taking the blame. The blame has to go somewhere and he takes the blame.
Pat mentions the heat for the bad decisions, but you don’t get credit for the good decisions. Pat asks if he has a favorite moment or run. Vince says Wrestlemania 1 was important to him because he went all in and put everything on the line. Vince says he wasn’t a millionaire. Vince says he told his dad he had the money but he didn’t really have it. He talks about having to make balloon payments back in the day.
Vince says competing with the other guys, they were millionaires and he only had cash flow. When he would go into St. Louis, he was going into another person’s territory.
Pat mentions Young Rock and if Pat has seen the person who plays him and Vince says he probably wouldn’t watch it. Pat mentions a scene when ‘Vince’ was negotiating to bring in talent from Hawaii.
Vince says he has never had a bodyguard and back then, it would have been easy to take him out. In the territory days, people would threaten him. Vince mentions a story Jim Ross told him about Bill Watts and the NWA where they were talking about taking care of the kid invading him. He says they couldn’t even meet to discuss it. Vince says Jim wasn’t in the meeting and he was in the men’s room and four of the promoters talked about offing Vince. They were talking about people they knew. Vince says Jim was probably thinking about being an accessory to murder so he cannot be seen in the stall.
Vince says Jim told him about that five years after Vince signed him.
Pat asks Vince about enjoying confrontation and if that led him into situations others might not have considered. Pat mentions the Saudi Arabia shows. Was it because they were fans? What do you expect from those meetings? Has the country developed since the relationship started. Vince says the Saudis are no different from other fans. They have had a presence in Saudi Arabia for years. Saudi fans are enthusiastic. People love western culture all over the world. Vince says the WWE style fits in everywhere because it is larger than life. You understand the product regardless of the language. People are people and cultures are cultures and you have to respect that.
Pat asks how does Vince do it all. Is every day the same? Is he like all of the billionaires? Vince says he finishes training around 3 AM. He says he starts around 1:30. He says he always overtrains but that is his only outlet. Vince says he does it for his head more than his body. He says it is good for him and he tries to eat the right things. It helps him mentally and psychologically. It allows him to handle his workload. Dealing with people can be a problem.
Pat asks if there was ever a day he doubted what he wanted to do. You learn from your decisions, whether it is good or bad. How did you make it happen and what were the tools that got you there. Vince says he has never had a down day.
Vince says all decisions come down to common sense. You need information to make your decision.
Pat asks if there was a decision Vince said he wouldn’t make and then Pat remembers that Vince said he doesn’t like negatives.
Pat asks about the evolution of the product.
Pat asks Vince what is next for WWE in the future. Vince says he loves branding and marketing. What makes this Wrestlmania different? He says the word stupendous isn’t used much so people have to look it up. Vince says it is not in everyday speak so you want to get people’s attention.
Pat asks if Vince if he is strutting around the office with the dinosaur head and how long does it take to come up with this. Vince says if you are concentrating on one thing at the moment and something comes at you and it is creative, it is a great relief because you learn from everything. It is a creative wheel that is constantly moving.
Vince says you need to be wide open to be creative. You need to accept whatever is coming in from whatever source. Vince says when he gets tired, which is seldom, you can focus on one thing.
Pat asks how far in advance does he have to look for WWE while dealing with the current product. Vince says you have to look at the big picture and the little picture to know where you want to go. With WWE, they can fit into almost anything because of the structure and the way they think. The talent ‘graduates’ from WWE with more than a doctoral level degree. You have respect and that is huge in WWE.
Vince says they hug each other and shake hands in the Gorilla Position. I want you to protect me when I am in the ring with you. I don’t want you to injure or paralyze me. You need to respect each other. It hurts when you come back from the ring.
Pat mentions Vince showing Gronkowski falling off the balcony two years ago at Wrestlemania and how it was nothing for Vince to do it.
Pat says that it is unbelievable the number of times that Vince talks to him. Pat says that the Mr. McMahon character is like a robot and that he will live forever.
Vince mentions his mother was 101 when she passed away. Vince says if he was hit by a bus today, he would want one second to thank everyone and appreciate life. You cannot take things for granted.
Pat mentions the show Succession and how there are comparisons to what is going on in WWE. Were there worries about WWE not being his at some point. Vince says he does not think about that a lot. He says he hopes the company will continue whether with a family member or not. You have to be objective and look at family members like other employees. Vince says he expects more from his family. Vince says he has to do the right thing for the business. If it isn’t working out, then you have to deal with it.
Pat mentions how Vince has changed a lot of lives and that Vince should be celebrated more. Pat says Vince is a model for people who didn’t grow up with money.
Vince makes an offer to Pat. He says he knows that Pat loves what they do and how people and fans enjoy Pat being himself. Vince says Bob Costas wouldn’t be dancing on a desk. Vince offers Pat a chance to wrestle at Wrestlemania. Vince says it is different than when he was a punter with the Colts. He would be a linebacker.
Pat says that people have talked about him getting back in the ring. He says that he used to steal Wrestlemania when he was younger.
Vince says he will find an opponent for Pat at Wrestlemania.
Pat mentions the ring in his studio and how it hurts.
Pat asks if this is real and Vince says he does not bulls***.
Vince asks if it will work and Pat’s staff says it will work and they suggest the Undertaker and Vince says it won’t be against Taker.
Vince is asked if it is easier or more difficult to cultivate talent. Vince says it is a team effort. You have to bring that character into the ring and the crowd needs to buy it. Vince talks about stuff they would do after shows and how he almost got Undertaker to do a Spinaroonie, but Taker never broke character. Vince says they are superstars because anyone can wrestle, poorly or well, but do you want to be a professional wrestler or a WWE Superstar. Vince says WWE Superstar sounds better than professional wrestler. You need to be able to grow. If you are not growing, you are dying. You have to have that desire to be everything you can be when you are in the ring. Don’t be that character in real life.
Vince says the really good ones can be the character in the ring and themselves outside the ring.
Pat asks what combination works best. Vince says it is who does it best. It might be best for your mental health not to be that person outside the ring.
Pat asks Vince about maintaining this schedule without destroying his body. Vince says you don’t think about it. You have opportunities coming at you and sometimes they are not good for you. You have to be able to grow. You have to know what you want and what you don’t want.
Pat says he thought it would be impossible for Vince to appear in studio but he asks if Vince is working on the road. Vince says he is having fun and doing work.
Vince is asked about whether he thought about missing shows during COVID. Vince says what everyone else does is different. Vince says they weren’t going to miss a beat. They might not have had an audience, but they did not miss a show. Vince says it is a testament to the roster for performing and becoming better human beings. Vince says they had their training facility and it would give them a clean environment for the people to come in. He says it was difficult for things to happen without an audience because of the reaction the performers in front of an audience.
Vince says they have a focus group every night and if there is no reaction to what he wants to present to the audience, he knows it didn’t work. You know immediately.
Vince says you can see in the ring what is working and through the audience. Vince says the internet audience can be harsh and he does not listen to them. It is all for the audience. You aren’t doing it for yourself, you are doing it for the audience.
Pat mentions a comment Aleister Black said about music he was using and Vince didn’t understand it. Vince says you listen to people and give them as much creative liberty as possible, they can work better. You need to lead. You cannot just wait. You cannot dictate to the audience what they are going to like.
Pat says he does not do well with bosses, but when he signed with the WWE, he said people were waiting to hear what happens when Vince talks to him about what to say and Pat says he was looking forward to Vince in his ears. Pat says he has enjoyed Vince letting him do his thing. Vince says if he didn’t like what Pat was doing, he wouldn’t be doing it. If it is getting over, it is working. You are having fun doing what you are doing.
Pat asks Vince to explain Brock Lesnar. Vince says he is an extraordinary human being and a smart man. Vince says people think he is a neanderthal and he might look like one, but he is probably smarter than you.
Pat says that he has been asking Brock for advice. Pat says Brock said his relationship with Dana White is different than Vince McMahon. He said that Vince is like a father figure and Brock credited Vince for his other success.
Pat mentions how the Rock is the biggest star on Earth and Steve Austin can do what he wants. Pat mentions how Goldberg is staying a star because of WWE.
Pat asks if he stays in touch with these people. There are times when he is busy, but he does not lose contact with the people. It is good business to stay in touch with these people. Vince says he is appreciative of everyone who has stepped in the ring.
Pat asks Vince about the Attitude Era. Vince says it was so much fun and they were able to do anything. He says they had a blast. Vince talks about the bedpan spot from Austin. Vince says that Austin was thinking about whether he should hit Vince with the bedpan. He says Austin was testing it lightly on his own head and then he did it.
Pat asks about what live television means for the product. Vince says you are on the edge. Vince says it is so exciting. There is pressure but you live for that moment. You have done something really good. To hear the people applaud the performances.
Pat mentions Michael Cole and Vince says he is a ‘horrible human being’ while rolling his eyes in jest. Pat says that Cole comes alive when the music starts.
Pat asks Vince if he gets excited before shows. Vince says all the time. You are into the show when you write it. The vision of what you are trying to tell and if it comes out as well as you think it is great. Sometimes it comes out better. There are also times when it doesn’t work as well. When the crowd reactions the right way, you feel it.
Pat says he heard the stories about Vince but he mentions Vince’s energy. Vince says the crew does it twice a week. No one does it like this anywhere in the world. They have the largest traveling show in the world. The production folks are the best in the world. They have had cameramen who have been with the company for 15 to 20 years. There is a grind to be on the road. It is extraordinary that so many people want to do this.
Pat says if the leader is tired, it can have a ripple effect. Vince says no one will know if he is tired.
Vince says he could have a horrible phone call or meeting, but he is not going to bring it into the next appointment. That is bad business. You might be pissed off, but why bring it to the meeting.
Vince says he didn’t like school and he didn’t learn how to study. He had to go to summer school to get into college. It took him five years to get through college. Vince mentions he graduated with a degree in business administration. Vince says that Linda graduated in three years. Vince went to a few professors and wanted to talk to them about their grades. One was willing to change his grade after his pitch while the other didn’t. Vince says the professor was going to call the cops and Vince says he had nothing to lose.
Vince is asked whether he thought he would be a WWE Superstar. Vince says he had to become one in order to appear on screen. It was a blast being on there with Steve Austin. Vince says that he was Austin. He grew up that way.
Pat talks about how people consider Vince the greatest heel of all time. Vince says you want people to really dislike you and when you are into that character, you need people to attach themselves to the character.
Vince says the difficulty is that when you are performing, you cannot produce or direct. Vince says he would rather be on the other side of the camera because that is where the action is and you can live vicariously through all of the characters. He says he misses out on the other people when he is focused on his character.
Pat asks Vince about injuries he has suffered that we have not heard about. Vince talks about how it is hard to sever both quads at the same time. You can’t walk or stand when you do that. You have to learn how to walk again.
Pat mentions how great the people around Vince are. Vince says they are professionals and quality human beings.
Vince mentions he was late, but you need to look good because no one cares about the reason why you are late.
Pat says Vince has been so cool and nice during every conversation they have had. Pat mentions how he was dressed at Wrestlemania in New York and he says that Michael Cole wanted to keep him off the show. He says that Vince says he appreciated and respected that Pat dressed the way he did.
Vince says he has enjoyed the whole thing.
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